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Topic: Nursing Home Residents Mental Health

  1. blondguy
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    9 January 2017

    Hey everybody. I never knew that the Government deemed Nursing Home residents 'not to be patients in the community' therefore nearly all dont qualify for psychological treatment. (dementia excluded)

    Here is an excerpt from the SMH article January 7 2017 re the Fairfax Media Investigation.

    "Under the rule almost all nursing home residents are denied GP mental
    health treatment plans and associated psychological therapies provided
    to other Australians under the Better Access Medicare program, because
    the government deems residents not to be patients "in the community".


    Despite extreme rates of mental illness in nursing homes – with about 82,000 of
    176,000 residents estimated to suffer a mental illness (excluding
    dementia) or significant mental distress – the Turnbull government reaffirmed the regulatory exclusion late last year"

    Lucky Country? Not if you have a mental illness in a nursing home it isnt

    Are we still in the dark ages? This is a disgrace and blatantly discriminatory.

    your thoughts are most welcome

    Paul

    3 people found this helpful
  2. BballJ
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    9 January 2017 in reply to blondguy

    Hi Paul,

    That's quite incredible. I know Mental Health assistance in Australia still has ways to go for all age groups but the elderly, especially those in nursing homes being denied what I think should be a basic human right, I think about my grandmother who is not far away from a home but I hope my dad and his siblings would fight it as long as they can because I just don't know if they get a fair shake of things once they go in.

    My best,

    Jay

  3. blondguy
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    10 January 2017 in reply to BballJ

    Hi Jay

    thankyou for responding and taking the time to read my post.

    I found it disturbing too. I dont blame you thinking about your grandmother and family.

    Lets hope that nursing home residents can be considered part of the community so they can access mental health care.

    Great to have you on the forums Jay. Paul

  4. geoff
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    10 January 2017 in reply to blondguy
    dear Paul, this is disastrous, and I can well and truly vouch for this when my dear Mum was in a nursing home for at least 13 years, where every year she unfortunately got worse and was highly depressed.
    She knew what she was in for once she got there, and was depressed from day one until she passed away, but didn't receive any mental health assistance, so how can a lady with all the charm and grace want to throw the ball around with other residents when all she wanted was to die, because she had no reason to live even though her children and ocassionally grand children visited her, it was pure hell for her, but not one qualified person went to see her except for her doctor, she needed help.
    Not only was Mum depressed but it was full of other residents who lost the will to live because they too were all depressed, so it was depressing going to see her, no matter how much I loved her, I went because that's what my wife (ex) insisted upon.
    It's sad when you have other residents who are crying out for help but no one pays any attention to them, so they are given a pill to quiten them down and go to sleep, that's not a life, and that's not how we should treat them, and remember some or most of these people may have entered the nursing home already suffering from depression.
    We used to take Mum out but her reaction was just a pretence to how she was feeling, so what has now happened is that the government have just pushed these people aside, wishing that they didn't have to pay for the extra costs to contribute for keeping them alive.
    If only euthanasia was made legal I would help Mum not to have to suffer any longer, and I would do it with all my love to safe her from misery, because I loved her. Geoff.
    3 people found this helpful
  5. gld
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    10 January 2017 in reply to blondguy

    Hi,

    What the hell is wrong with it everything!

    I feel the people running the country lose some a grip on what goes on in the real world.

    If anything people in residential communities need more assistance with mental health. Wish some of them could spend some time talking to some of Australian Citizens living in this environment and then make decisions like this.

    A couple of things i have noticed spending time with people in this type of environment has been [grief and loss].

    Even though they have there own space they have been moved out of a place they have lived in for years, the shops they have visited weekly/daily have changed so Beth their hairdresser is not there for a style and chat. In some cases people have had their licences and cars taken away from them so there independence and freedom has changed drastically. Someone who has neighbours to visits and find it hard to make friends have no one.

    They have contributed to taxes during their lives so it is a natural thing to allow them to access benefits that is out there for other Australian Citizens.

    Gen.

    1 person found this helpful
  6. kanga_brumby
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    10 January 2017

    My buddy Paul what can I say. I am in a nursing home, I have seen it first hand. Plus the times I personally requested to see a GP. Then waited a couple of days to have to ask again and again. Two weeks after the first request I see a GP. I have asked to see a mental health worker. Over a month ago guess what( this is a hard one) you got it still waiting. I am supposed to be in one of the better old age care facilities here. The neglect I see and have experienced. It's a farce.

    Kanga

    1 person found this helpful
  7. blondguy
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    10 January 2017 in reply to geoff

    Dear Geoff..Thankyou for being here....Your poor mum and what she went through...may she rest in peace x

    When I read the Fairfax article that 'nursing home residents are not considered 'part of the general community' I felt sick to my stomach. They dont even get basic Cognitive Behavioral Therapy to help them cope.

    Not proud to be an Australian on this disgraceful exclusion from the Federal Govt/Medicare.

    This is a disgrace and blatantly discriminatory. Paul

  8. blondguy
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    10 January 2017 in reply to blondguy

    * Correction/typo..Excuse I...

    ' the government deems residents not to be patients "in the community".


  9. blondguy
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    10 January 2017 in reply to gld

    Hi Gen, Thankyou for your take on shameful situation. Im still shaking my head in disbelief that mental illness isnt included for treatment for patients in nursing homes.

    Gen Said: "They have contributed to taxes during their lives so it is a natural
    thing to allow them to access benefits that is out there for other
    Australian Citizens"

    Me thinks we should be making some serious noise on this one. I found a word for this 'exclusion of patients with mental illnesses in nursing homes'

    'UnAustralian. Thanks again Gen. My Best. Paul

    1 person found this helpful
  10. gld
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    624 posts
    10 January 2017 in reply to blondguy

    Hi Blondguy [Paul],

    Thanks for putting this post up and others posting.

    Australian Government could do a lot of things for people in these communities. In Holland students live in the communities while studying for so many hours a week spending time with residents and making their lives more interesting.

    I feel this sort of thing could be structured here and it could be a win win for all. It may not get them the mental health plans from the government but just imagine the better well being improvement it could have.

    Government could save money with youth housing, boost help in communities and maybe be able to spend money they save on the health needs our seniors deserve or they may not have a big need for it. Everyone needs to have purpose and interest in their lives.

    Have read and seen different things that could improve our elder/disabled citizens from being put in these places that are so dark and dank.

    Australia has made big improvements to these places but have a long way to go.

    Keep up the great work Paul.

    Gen

    PS Sorry if i got off the subject Guys/Gals

  11. blondguy
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    10 January 2017 in reply to kanga_brumby

    Hey Kanga and thankyou for your high quality input (as usual) too!

    Kanga Said: "The neglect I see and have experienced. It's a farce"

    Unless I am delusional the year is 2017 not 1971. The way you are being treated smacks of the dark ages Kanga. When I read about your situation here (and on another thread) it only confirmed the Fairfax Media Investigations' results. A National disgrace.

    Thanks Peter

    my kindest thoughts for you

    Paul

    1 person found this helpful
  12. blondguy
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    10 January 2017 in reply to gld

    Hey Gen

    your support (and heartfelt compliment) is really appreciated

    Holland has always had a common sensed approach to their people and you are not off point at all. The longer this thread stays on the air with pro-active ideas like yours the better Gen and thanks too :-)

    my respect. Paul

  13. kanga_brumby
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    10 January 2017 in reply to blondguy

    Uncle Paul what can I say but some of the staff really try there best. But from what I have experienced from both sides I have been a worker in the industry. Some of the residents actually do hit deliberately the workers. Then claim diminished responsibility, Knowing full well that if they were out in the community. They would be up on charges. Or deliberately telling he/she interfered with me. When in reality it never happened. Sometimes it's true but not always. A lot of it is what the Department Of (in)Human Services tell the providers what is expected. Now go and do it. With no questions asked, do it this way. It's also funding they can only have so many staff on at one time. Which means someone has to go without some times, or wait a bit longer. But with high unemployment, surely we can hire a few more people. But then we open the door to possible abuse from the new or old staff. Through jealousy or we don't really wan't to be here, so here cop this.

    Kanga

  14. blondguy
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    10 January 2017 in reply to kanga_brumby

    Hey Kanga

    i had a feeling that you had worked in the industry before therefore you have a better view of both sides of the fence than I will ever have.

    Re: Funding. The Federal government announced the Shortfin Barracuda Submarines to be supplied by French shipbuilder DCNS last year at a cost of $50,000,000,000 ($AU50 Billion Dollars)

    I just dont see the 'care factor' for mental health care anywhere in that $50 Billion dollars

    Lucky Country...lol... Not if you have a mental illness in a nursing home it isnt. Lets hope that the Fairfax Media Investigation results in that patients in a nursing home (with a mental illness) get the health care they deserve.

    Thankyou Kanga.

    Paul

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  15. geoff
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    11 January 2017 in reply to blondguy
    dear Paul, where is the balance in life, or is there any, no I don't think so.
    You know it only took Mr. Andrew's father to pass away to change his mind about voting in parliament for euthanasia, but why does it have to resort to this because someone very close to them dies, the same goes for those poor people who are in a nursing home and are mentally unwell, so does this mean that it needs a politician's parent/s to be placed into a nursing home and mentally unwell for any change to happen, or are these people given special treatment which I'm sure is paid for by the taxpayer.
    $50 billion is a hell of a lot of money to be spend on submarines that could be blown out of the water straight away. Geoff.
  16. 1113
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    11 January 2017 in reply to blondguy

    Hi,

    Paul, I couldn't help myself. This made me feel like vomiting. Peace.

    --------

    This is an absolute disgrace.

    Mental illness is a silent killer and a serious medical condition. How could you call it a "nursing home" when you don't provide proper nursing.

    These people worked all there lives and paid taxes like everyone else in the population.

    I'm horrified to think of the torment each one of these patients has to go through on every second, hourly and daily bases.

    This is a blatant human rights issue that should be seen to by the high court.

    This is just as bad as terrorism, only our government is doing it to our own people.

    The hair on the back of my neck is standing up! Thats how disgusted I am after reading this.

    These poor humans have my complete support and understanding.

    I wish I knew how I could help them!

    Absolutely disgusting.

    Money spent on war to kill other humans, while the real problem is swept under the carpet.

    What is wrong with this world.

    Politicians need a big dose of reality.

    My prayers are with them.

    Matt

    1 person found this helpful
  17. blondguy
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    11 January 2017 in reply to geoff

    Hi Geoff

    You make a great point about a politicians' father passing to be the catalyst for a change of mind on the euthanasia vote. If their parent required mental health care they would probably be in a private nursing home facility with all the bells & whistles.

    I still cant get my head around that $50 Billion dollars for some submarines..It breaks every rule in the book Really appreciate your care and input on this matter Geoff. My Best. Paulx

  18. blondguy
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    11 January 2017 in reply to 1113

    Hi Matt

    Thanks for responding. You werent the only one that felt like vomiting.....I hear you there

    1113 (Matt) Said "I'm horrified to think of the torment each one of these patients has to go through on every second, hourly and daily bases."

    and "Mental illness is a silent killer and a serious medical condition. How
    could you call it a "nursing home" when you don't provide proper
    nursing"

    Great post Matt! You have really helped 'spread the word' .

    I still cant fathom that people with mental health issues in nursing homes arent deemed as part of the community

    This is a disgrace and blatantly discriminatory. Thankyou again Matt for your high level input and support. Paul

  19. kanga_brumby
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    12 January 2017

    So the saga continues. I get a blockage in my ears from ear wax. Get it fixed, It comes back, When I am at home 3 days fixed, in a nursing home by the time they get a doctor in wright it up. Even then I have to remind them to use the drops. It takes about 2 weeks to fix the problem. Plus I get a scoreation in the groin area. They treat it separately it keeps on returning. I keep asking to see a doctor. If I am lucky a week later I might get seen to. As I have said I am supposed to be in one of the better old aged homes in the state. The neglect I have seen. Shudder It is worse in other places I Know.

    Thats my beef for today Have a nice day people. Sorry about being a grumble bum.

    Kanga

  20. blondguy
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    13 January 2017 in reply to kanga_brumby

    Hi Peter

    You of all people arent and never could be a grumble bum....seriously

    You are roughly my age and you have a healthier attitude than I would have in your situation. Even a minor (yet important) issue like getting our ears syringed seems like a no brainer. I just dont understand why someone should have to be going through the 'wringer' as you are.

    I may end up in a nursing home myself Peter. By then I really hope that patients in a nursing home are 'deemed' as part of the community...In 2017 its unacceptable that patients in a nursing home with a mental illness do not qualify for mental health care under current federal legislation.

    I really hope that other people reading this thread can make a difference by voicing their thoughts as you have

    Recap from Paul;

    'Medicare excludes almost all nursing home residents from having GP mental
    health treatment plans and associated psychological therapies provided
    to other Australians under the Better Access Medicare program, because
    the government deems residents not to be patients "in the community'

    Thankyou Peter for helping make a difference...however small

    my kind thoughts

    Paul

    1 person found this helpful
  21. gld
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    16 January 2017 in reply to blondguy

    Hi Blondguy,

    Thought you may want to check this out it is from The Sydney Morning Herald -http://www.smh.com.au/national/health/nursing-homes-follow-head-20170111-gtpis6.html

    Gen

    2 people found this helpful
  22. 1113
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    17 January 2017 in reply to gld

    Peaceful morning all,

    Thanks for that info gld.

    I enjoyed the read.

    Peace

  23. pipsy
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    17 January 2017 in reply to blondguy

    Hi Paul, I too have heard this complaint countless times. With my job we often have to take nursing home residents to outside Dr's for medication, and for snacks, etc, but their mental health status is being ignored and overlooked, constantly. They often suffer chronic depression as a result of being ignored and told to 'stop the nonsense'. Their families too are told to ignore their 'stories' of bossy staff members who are too busy to be bothered. Even the visiting Dr's are 'pre-warned' of the 'rubbish' these people talk as it is considered not worth the effort. Maybe if some of the politicians who require our votes to remain in their positions would step away from their zones and visit some of these places with eyes and ears open. How do you re-educate the uneducated? Lynda

    1 person found this helpful
  24. pipsy
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    17 January 2017 in reply to pipsy
    Hi, looking at how the politicians overlook the nursing home neglect makes me question how they would be treated if they were to be placed in one by families who are unwilling/unable to care for them. Depression and work/family commitment often means the families are unable to care for their elderly relatives. Put a politician or family member of one in a nursing home, he would possibly buy it first, then hire staff for the personal needs. Interesting conception? $50 billion dollars would be better if used constructively instead of destructively. Lynda
    1 person found this helpful
  25. blondguy
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    17 January 2017 in reply to gld

    Hi Gen and thanks for the link and your support on this vile situation with nursing home patients 'not deemed to part of the general community that qualify for free mental health care. Greatly appreciated. I'll have a sticky at that link

    Best. Paul

  26. Doolhof
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    17 January 2017 in reply to kanga_brumby

    Hi Kanga and Everyone,

    I've skimmed through this thread. Some of the stories have saddened me immensely. Off and on I have worked in the Aged Care industry for about 20 years. Thankfully the last years have been in the community assisting people in their own homes.

    I've certainly heard many stories from clients whose partners have been placed in care, or friends with parents in care.

    Last year I completed a TAFE course regarding care for the aged and disabled. It covered being aware of all needs of the clients/residents, including, social, mental, physical, spiritual and so on. It seems for some reason that is not carried out and some basic human rights are neglected for one reason or another.

    Kanga, do you have family who can take you to an "outside" DR? Do you know of any Advocacy person who can step in for you to ensure you are treated as you deserve to be? Is it possible to request a copy of your rights as a resident in the home?

    My heart goes out to you Kanga and to everyone who is not given the due care deserved.

    One of my clients is popping into the nursing home unannounced at various times of the day to check on the welfare of her husband. Well as unannounced as one can be when you need to enter via reception, a secure door, and under the noses of the staff.

    I too have read about the initiative in Holland where students can stay free in aged care, agreeing to spend time with the residents. My first question there is "How on earth do they find a bed for these students?" Many people have to wait long periods of time to enter a home, and it may not even be a place of their choice, just the first available bed. It could be in Timbuktu or out beyond the Black Stump.

    Holland does have a wonderful village also where residents with dementia live as though they are still in the community. We can learn a lot from other countries.

    Kanga, sometimes those who make the most noise are the most cared for.

    Sending you a hug if you would like one. Cheers from Mrs. Dools

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  27. blondguy
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    17 January 2017 in reply to pipsy

    Hi Pipsy, Thankyou for your experience and support on this important matter.

    The politicians' aged relatives would most likely be in a private nursing home with all the bells and whistles and the huge price tag and billable mental health care as an option. Thanks again Pipsy. Paul :-)

    1 person found this helpful
  28. blondguy
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    17 January 2017 in reply to pipsy

    Thanks again Gen for that link. The article in the Sydney Morning Herald is the one I researched and quoted when I was creating this thread. If others havent read the article I quoted some of it in my initial post...or here is the link..

    http://www.smh.com.au/national/health/nursing-homes-follow-head-20170111-gtpis6.html

    (just place this into the 'Google Search' bar and press go :-)

    Its blatantly discriminatory and a national disgrace

    Thanks everyone, Paul x

    1 person found this helpful
  29. pipsy
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    17 January 2017 in reply to blondguy
    Hi Paul, yeah nothing but the best for the pollies and their nearest and dearest eh!!! We 'poorer' folks are supposed to 'grin and accept'. Discrimination is alive and 'well?' Lynda
    1 person found this helpful
  30. kanga_brumby
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    17 January 2017 in reply to Doolhof

    mrs Doolhof my family is very fragmented. There is one here one there, we are all over the shop really. Plus each unit within the family has it's own medical issue to deal with. When I had my licence and car, if help was needed. I was there, as fast as I can. But the funny thing is I am the last to find out there is a problem. They for some reason hardly talk to me. So I is basically alone. Because of my health Child protection have taken my children away. The children don't visit me, because it's to boring in there. So I don't see me own kids. Which works wonders for my self esteem, and depression. I wish I could switch the two of them around. A low depression and a high self esteem. It's been said the squeaky door gets the oil. Not in here you get branded a trouble maker. It can take longer to get help if you complain to much. I was at a different facility before here that was even worse than here.

    Kanga

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